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A Post-Deadline Look at the Big East: St. John's Red Storm

St. John's was a deep, senior-laden team that finally lived up to the players' potential under first year Coach Steve Lavin. St. John's finished in fifth place in the Big East with a 12-6 record.  They finished the year with a 21-12 record and lost in the first (second) round of the NCAA tournament to Gonzaga. But you can pretty much throw all of that out the window as the Red Storm loses every single piece off of that team. Ok that's not entirely true, they do return one player off that team. That's right only one player. Steve Lavin will start from scratch next year.

Can St. John's compete in the Big East with a team of all Freshman?

Star-divide

Key Losses:

Graduating: Dwight Hardy (18.3pts, 2.9rbds, 1.9asts), DJ Kennedy (10.4pts, 5.6rbds, 2.0asts), Justin Brownlee (12.3pts, 5.2rbds, 1.9asts), Paris Horne (7.9pts, 2.9rbds), Justin Burrell (6.3pts, 4.9rbds), Malik Boothe (4.1pts, 2.9asts), Dele Coker (0.9pts, 1.2rbds), Sean Evans (3.6pts, 2.7rbds)

Early Entry: None

Transferring: Dwayne Polee (4.4pts, 2.5rbds)

Key Returns:

Seniors: None

Juniors: Malk Stith (3.3pts, 0.9rbds, 0.9asts)

Sophomores: None

Incoming Recruits:

Sir'Dominic Pointer 6'6" SF 41 Scout, 44 Rivals, 24 ESPN

Jakarr Sampson 6'7" SF 40 Scout, 51 Rivals, 31 ESPN

Maurice Harkless 6'6" SF 45 Scout, 41 Rivals, 38 ESPN

D'Angelo Harrison 6'3" SG 62 Scout, 40 Rivals, 63 ESPN

Norvel Pelle 6'9" PF 79 Scout, 23 Rivals, 76 ESPN

Amir Garrett 6'6" SF 80 Scout, 68 Rivals, 97 ESPN

Phillip Greene 6'2" SG NR

Nurideen Lindsey 6'4" SG #2 Junior College Transfer according to Jucorecruiting.com

God's Gift Achiuwa 6'9" PF #24 Junior College Transfer according to Jucorecruiting.com

St. John's is the hardest team to get a read on, since it's an entirely different team from last year. The Red Storm goes from the third most experienced team in the nation (first among major conference schools) to what has to be the least experienced roster in the nation.  There's almost no point in doing the normal they lose this percent of their scoring, etc lists, but I will because these numbers amuse me so much.

St. John's loses:

  • 96.3 percent of their scoring
  • 98.8 percent of their rebounding
  • 94.5 percent of their assists
  • 93.6 percent of their steals
  • 98.9 percent of their blocks

The one returning player Malik Stith is the only true point guard currently on the roster. St. John's may still add another recruit as they could definitely use a point guard since that is the one thing their incoming class of freshman is missing. They attempted to get Arizona transfer MoMo Jones. However, due to a new NCAA rule prohibiting players from signing with a school that has hired one of their high school or AAU coaches for two years after the coach is signed Jones cannot sign with the Red Storm.

St. John's brings in what is generally considered the third best recruiting class in the nation. It's a great class, it's very large and has six top one hundred players in it as well as two highly regarded junior college transfers. There are, however, several problems with this class that could cause problems for next year's squad. First of all, there is a lot of redundancy in this class.  There are four true small forwards, none of whom really have the height or bulk to play in the post in the Big East. They only have two true post players and then three shooting guards, none of whom are true point guards. The second issue is that while all these players are well regarded, none of them are consensus top twenty-five, five-star players that will definitely make an instant impact. It's not that they cannot or will not be great from the beginning, but there are no sure-fire one-and-done players in this class. The final issue with this class is that the majority of them are high-upside players and athletes. The issue here is that on the whole they don't have great developed basketball skills and have been getting by on their athleticism alone. That's not going to cut it in the Big East.

  • Sir'Dominic Pointer: Here's a word you're going to be hearing a lot in these write ups: Athletic. Pointer is a great athlete. He's long and a solid defender. He can finish in transition and has a decent shot, but needs to keep developing his basketbal skills as his handle is shakey and he needs a lot of time to get his shot off.
  • Jakarr Sampson: Pretty much identical. He's an athlete with high upside and potential but needs to develop a consistent shot and a handle. He's a good shot blocker and defender.
  • Maurice Harkless: Again pretty similar. High upside athlete. A better mid range shooter than the first two, but a worse defender. He needs to add strength and put forth more effort on the defensive end.
  • D'Angelo Harrison is a excellent three point shooter. He can also get to the rim, but his handle needs work for the Big East level. Not a point guard by any means. He like Harkless needs to put more focus and effort on the defensive end.
  • Norvel Pelle: Is the ultimate high potential little current pay off player. He's a bouncy ahtlete who can get put back dunks and block shots, but that's about it. He has no back to the basket game right now. He brings the ball down low and has terrible foot work. He is also not a great rebounder. The major concern is his attitude. He does not bring it every game and is often lackadaisical. You never know what you're going to get intensity wise.
  • Amir Garrett  Is the opposite of Pelle in terms of intensity. He's always going to bring it and hustle hard. However he's also just like the first three small forwards. Great athlete, but needs to develop perimeter skills: Shooting, passing, ball handling. He's a very good defender.
  • Phillip Greene bit of a combo guard. Not a great shooter, but good at attacking the rim. Needs to add strength.
  • Nurideen Lindsey: Reports are conflicting all the current rankings have him listed as a shooting guard, but prior to going to junior college he was referred to as a point guard. He's a big time scorer so if he can play point will still be a shoot first point guard. He will have three years of eligibility remaining.
  • God's Gift Achiuwa Will provided an experienced interior player for St. Johns. Will be the starting center from day one most likely as his post game is more developed than Pelle. He will have two years of eligibility remaining.

St. John's will be an interesting team to watch. If nothing else they'll at least have an all-names team. The Johnnies are playing a very tough out of conference schedule that will throw these freshman right into the fire. It's impossible to say at this point if they will be able to compete at the Big East level from the beginning or if they'll struggle this year. One thing that is for sure is it will most likely be entertaining either way. St. John's could finish as high as sixth and as low as fourteenth. I tend to think they'll be towards the lower end of that spectrum. The Big East is the worst league in the country to be young in. It's more physical than other conferences and the coaching is better. Experience is huge in this league as St. John's learned last year. They're about to learn the counter point to that lesson this year.

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Good Material

for right now this team is all glitter, but I’m predicting next year at least 2 or 3 of them will transfer due to lack of playing time.

Furthermore the pressure of rising to the occasion in such a competitive conference.

by Big Spoon on May 25, 2011 1:42 PM EDT reply actions  

good stuff.

Rumble in the Garden - St. John's blog with thunderous undertones, on SB Nation | Follow on Facebook | Follow on Twitter

by picodulce on May 25, 2011 2:04 PM EDT reply actions  

one thing...

About the supposed redundancies and lack of a point guard – I think the idea is to have a lot of length in the zone, interchangeable parts – like the West Virginia team from two years ago. A lot of those guys were the same size, similar skills, and they worked well together.

And as for the PG thing, note that last year, St. John’s played with a “point guard” who didn’t really pass in Dwight Hardy. It made the team fairly defensible, but most of the other guys couldn’t get their shot anyway. I’m reminded of this watching Russell Westbrook, who is still learning the PG game; I think Nuri Lindsey will be a bit like that.

But with less defense.

Rumble in the Garden - St. John's blog with thunderous undertones, on SB Nation | Follow on Facebook | Follow on Twitter

by picodulce on May 25, 2011 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

all true

It would’ve been more accurate to say potential problems. There are certainly ways for them to be worked out.

What I’d be most concerned is if these guys get there and aren’t able to out athlete players they were in high school and then don’t have an answer for that.

This certainly will be a dangerous group if it can be kept together. I just don’t think they’re going to be able to come in in their first years and excel the way that st. John’s fans are expecting or hoping. I think there will be a rough wake up call for some players and fans as they adjust to the college game. I could be wrong I certainly haven’t seen these guys play extensively. I have to go based on what recruiting sites tell me. But i would be impressed with an NCAA birth although maybe less so if the BE keeps getting 11 teams in.

by hoyasincebirth on May 25, 2011 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

To be honest, it's more impressive to be the last BE team in if 10 or 11 make it

I think once 9 are in, the next two candidates have to make a much more compelling case to get in than a team with similar metrics from another power conference or mid-major. It’s easier for the selection committee to dump on that marginal Big East team than to risk the wrath from not inviting the 5th ACC team or whoever finishes third in the CAA.

The thing that frustrates me is that this Johnnies will be a painful comparison for our own program this season. If they can be more successful with a bunch of frosh and Malik Stith than we can be with a bunch of frosh and Hank/Clark/Hollis then I’m going to be quite peeved come March.

by HoyaSmacksYa on May 26, 2011 7:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

agreed

Though I don’t see more than 9 teams getting NCAA berths. Maybe 10, and that 10th might be Georgetown or Notre Dame or Cincinnati. Thing is, this year was a confluence of a really mediocre NCAA AND a really even Big East – the top teams weren’t that great and the talent clumped in the middle. It was hard to separate the 5th Big East team from the 11th; after that there was a clear division. And judging by the teams that played in the Finals, well, I think the NCAA was lacking in good teams, let alone “great” teams. The ACC struggled to get teams in but they’ll be better this year. The Pac-10 might be better too.

I think the St. John’s coaching staff is perfect for shepherding young players along, and they will suck early and show potential late, too late to make the NCAAs.

Rumble in the Garden - St. John's blog with thunderous undertones, on SB Nation | Follow on Facebook | Follow on Twitter

by picodulce on May 26, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

perhaps

I just have a notion that some of them will transfer due to the lack playing time and being in NYC (especially from those player who’re from that area)

by Big Spoon on May 26, 2011 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

sure

That always happens. Someone will get in one players’ ear and tell them the grass is greener in Cali or somewhere else. But having 9 freshmen and 10 total players means that playing time complaints aren’t really a big deal unless that player has other reasons to leave. Everyone will get a chance to shine.

Rumble in the Garden - St. John's blog with thunderous undertones, on SB Nation | Follow on Facebook | Follow on Twitter

by picodulce on May 26, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

and it was amazing to see how Lavin was able to grab so many bodies at a early start (I thought he would’ve been able to grab more JuCo players to balance out the youth movement).

Hopefully those NYC fans will be patient to see the youngs guys compete (even though it may not be pretty at times).

by Big Spoon on May 27, 2011 3:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

johnnies going to be very interesting

i suspect they’ll struggle this year to win on talent alone, but watch out if they can keep this core together over the next couple of years.

Casually.

by CasualHoya on May 25, 2011 3:21 PM EDT reply actions  

Lavin won a few fans last year

I’m interested in what he can cook up in 2-3 years…

Cuse delenda est

by onceahoya on May 25, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

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